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Talk:Character Creation Part Five: Skills
the whole 'skill families' thing doesn't make any sense, or at least jason doesn't apply it anywhere here. i think we should just delete it. :Well, I actually like the division, makes the skill list a bit more clear. Ausir 21:07, 24 October 2006 (EDT) well he writes "Weapons especially are now organized differently, to reflect a more realistic approach to weapons knowledge – if you are good with a regular pistol, you are equally as good with an Energy pistol, for example." which isn't reflected in the rules at all. i agree that the distinction is an important one to make, though. :Well, that's because it's still a working version - Jason meant to do that, but never got to doing it eventually. Ausir 18:53, 25 October 2006 (EDT) BIG GUNS I thought Big Guns was supposed to be based off Endurance? It's got strength in there, but you don't throw the bullets, you need the physical stamina to hold the gun steady as the recoil sends you flying. I think it needs to be STR + END + END + PE. : I personally support this for the reasons stated above. AG is a little too dominating when it comes to weapons skills, anyway. --Wanderer of the Wastes 07:33, September 13, 2009 (UTC) Skill Redundancy Some of the skills seem to have essentially the same purpose, and I think they could be made more useful and more enticing if they were combined. The first ones that come to mind are those with the exact same starting values, like "First Aid" and "Doctor". Both skills do essentially the same thing, and are based off the same stats. In fact, the only reason to ever take First Aid is to get the two extra uses per day. I think Fallout 3 had this one right when they combined it into "Medicine". It could be used 5 times, and would be effectively the same skill. : 2d10 and healing all crippled parts each time, or something else (Like saying they have a choice between healing 2d10 or healing a crippled part)? --Wanderer of the Wastes 07:49, September 13, 2009 (UTC) Like mentioned in the above conversation, the current energy weapons we have need to be divided between Small and Large Guns. I realize there's a certain degree of intelligence related to operating advanced machinery, but it is of little consequence. I mean, they aren't dramatically different like the primitive ranged weapons. : Large Guns is kinda close in name to Big Guns. Perhaps a different name for either (Like changing Big Guns to Heavy Guns or Heavy Weapons)? Also, I would guess Small Guns would cover Pistols and Sub-Machineguns as well as Energy Pistols? And then Rifles and Shotguns into Large Guns with the energy Rifles? In a sense, a change like this would make sense seeing as Big Guns seems to cover the Big energy weapons. --Wanderer of the Wastes 07:49, September 13, 2009 (UTC) Unarmed attacks and Melee attacks currently start at the same amount. I think one of them needs a stat tweak, and I think it's Melee Weapons. When fighting with the fists, agility is key to overcome the lack of power. But with the added power of Melee weapons comes the added recoil from strikes, so I think the starting Melee skill should be STR + STR + STR + END. : I'd support this. Not like you need much agility swinging that Super Sledge or Proton Axe. Also makes Endurance a little more useful and spreads out the stats needed for weapons skills a little more. --Wanderer of the Wastes 07:49, September 13, 2009 (UTC) And the last one is "Steal" and "Sneak". They both use the same stats to generate, and they're pretty much married skills. I mean, you don't really try to steal without sneaking, and if you didn't need to sneak to steal you probably wouldn't fail, so why make it separate? Maybe roll it into one new skill (Call it "Burglary" or something) that covers both sneak rolls and thieving checks. : You see, I disagree with this point on "Steal" and "Sneak." Take example of urchins and thieves in so many RPs, Arabian Tales, and 'Oliver' movies who will simply steal your stuff in plain day when they pass you by or 'accidentally' bump into you. Or in many cases, shoplifters aren't exactly the sneakiest sorts around. On the complete other side, I actually have a player who is sneaky without being a thief. His character is a Lone-Wolf sort of mercenary who would rather sneak in and scout and snipe then go in with the boys doing the main attack. My point is, there are many cases where "Sneak" and "Steal" are note hand in hand. --Wanderer of the Wastes 07:31, September 13, 2009 (UTC) EDIT: Oh, I know they aren't particularly related, but if you make "Medicine" out of First Aid and Doctor and then combine "Pilot" with "Repair" (Use the Repair skill value, and maybe call it Maintenance), then the two new skills could go under 'Technical' and that would give each skill area three skills. :I agree with most of the above poster's ideas; there are too many skills and not all of them are useful. I'd suggest the following changes: *"Throwing" and "Primitive Missile Weapons" into simply "Missile Weapons" (PE+PE+STR+AG) *"First Aid" and "Doctor" into "Medicine" (IN+IN+IN+PE) *"Traps" and "Lockpick" into "Security" *Consolidate "Sneak" and "Steal" into just "Sneak" *No "Gambling" skill; games of chance actually involve chance. GMs can add a LK check if they really want to (edit 7-27: okay, FINE, maybe a CH check too) Pika132 00:53, 28 January 2009 (UTC) :Gambling is not only about chance, it's also about bluffing, etc. Ausir 02:10, 2 February 2009 (UTC) :Speaking of redundant skills, climbing and swimming seem a bit too narrow for skills. Why not just have one Broad Athletics skill that covers stuff like climbing, running, swimming and maybe gymnastics? That fits more with the broad spectrum that Fallout skill tend to cover. Otherwise I agree with with Pika132, except about Gambling 19:07, 18 April 2009 (UTC) : I like the Ideas of "Missile Weapons," "Medicine," and "Security" (seriously, how many people use Traps?), but I find Sneak consolidated to be something I'd argue against. My argument against combining Sneak and Steal is above. Gambling should stay, and stay as is. --Wanderer of the Wastes 07:31, September 13, 2009 (UTC) : : Friends and I have come up with a combined Dr./First aid medicine skill equation. (5% + 2PE + EN + AG) : --Jeffman12 5:16, August 06, 2011 Hip Kick/Snap Kick You know, it occurs to me that Hip Kick seems rather ridiculous compared to Snap Kick. Hip Kick provides the same damage bonus while requiring 3 more AP and one more Agility. Perhaps reduce the AP cost for Hip Kick by 2 and give it an increase to critical hits? Wanderer of the Wastes 05:45, April 4, 2010 (UTC) Concerning the Sneak/Steal Controversy After thinking about it, I've decided to switch positions and agree with Wanderer of the Wastes (Especially if Lockpick and Traps are combined into "Security"). Still, it bothers me when two skills use the exact same stats to generate. Considering the pickpocket example you presented, what if "Steal" was AG + PE + CH + IN? Part of being a successful pickpocket is looking innocent, and that seems like Charisma's domain. Cjc7988 00:23, September 20, 2010 (UTC) Explosives I didin't like in New Vegas, when the repair skill was used to disarm traps. This traps skill is a good idea, particularly if you can now set traps. But, there needs to be a seperate skill for disarming mines. Someone good with sticks and strings does not not the glowing red button on a mine disarms it (hell, I didn't know until I used a skill magazine to teach a legionnaire how to do it). Also, someone who may be able to throw grenades really hard, may not know that you have to pull then pin and hold the spoon down. Grenades should have a minimum explosives skill to use. And they would probably be completely baffled by a pulse mine's mechanism. This skill could also be combined with(or override) traps skill when setting explosive traps like grenade bouquets. 09:59, April 22, 2011 (UTC) Jump Skill and the imperial system Why use imperial system units in the jump skill description? Falling distance descriptors are talking about yards, and could easily be said to be in meters for little difference in practice. Jumping distances are a bit trickier, but can be approximated for 1 meter (hex) per 13% in skill in a long jump, or 1 meter per 33% skill in high jump, both with a running start. Falling would become 1 meter per 10% for no damage or 1 meter per 5% for half damage. Darodrigues 17:48, January 5, 2012 (UTC) Regarding Skill Redundancy Looking above, you can see there was a bit of criticisim on this subject, and several solutions were posed. My question is would it be okay if I went ahead and put a few of these in motion? Turning the Repair and Pilot skills into Maintence seems pretty logical (it would be more simpler that way), as does abolishing Gambling and replacing it with a Luck roll. If I can get the thumbs-up from a higher-up, I'll try to put these changes forth. Thank you. Additional Skills: I would suggest that the Survival Skills get an overlook. You could say that Swim, Jump and Climb are athletics and could form a new family. What bugs me about Outdoorsman is, that it combines too many survival skills in one skill. You could say that outdoorsman is the knowledge about surviving in the wildernes, but this doesn't mean that you know everything there is to know. Thus i suggest adding Cooking, Tracking and Traps as additional skill in the survival theme. Also the Throw skill would fit more into an athletic theme than in basic weapons. My suggestions are like this: Simple Weapons(2) -Unarmed -Melee Weapons Ranged Weapons(4) -Explosives (includes disarming mines) -Small Guns -Big Guns -Energy Weapons Medicine(3) -First Aid -Doctor -Chems (create medicine out of manufactured chemicals) Thieving(4) -Sneak -Lockpick -Steal -Disguise Technical(3) -Science -Repair (doesn't dismantle traps) -Pilot Social(3) -Speech -Barter -Gambling Survival(4) -Outdoorsman (detecting water supplies, identify animals in sight, identify poisonous plants etc.) -Tracking (identify footprints and skid marks etc. Follow tracks and erase them properly if wanted.) -Traps (create and dismantle traps, except for mines hazards can still be disarmed but don't defuse any explosions so any explosion conected could still explode if picked up!) -Cooking (creating non perishable food out of natural supplies(meat and stuff), also used to create potions out of plants be used to create medicine out of manufactured chemicals like the chems skill could make food more tasty increasing its value when selling) Athletics(4) -Jump -Climb -Swim -Throw Total of skills available would be increased to 27.